You might not know Ray Green. If you are in sales, I suggest you do. .
Ray and I go back about 20 years, to when he brought me in to train his sales team when he was with the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. It was his first sales management role.
He now runs a company that handles the entire sales departments for software companies that don’t have expertise in it. After 40+ plus years in this business I’m a pretty good reader of a brilliant sales minds, and he is one of them.
His podcast episode with me just dropped. He’s a host who actually listens (notice his pauses after my answers in the episode) asks smart follow-up questions, and takes the conversation into places that are useful.
In other words, not the usual:
"So Art, tell us your three tips for making cold calls."
Thankfully
We covered a lot in his podcast…
AI Isn't Replacing Salespeople. It's Exposing Them.
Personalization Without Relevance Is Just Creepy
The “wussification” of sales
Pattern Interrupts Should Not Be Gimmicks
Your Value Proposition Isn't a Value Proposition Yet
The Opening Has Only Two Jobs
Stop Asking for Another Call When You're Already On One
The Salesperson's Oath: First, Create No Resistance
Assistants Are Not Gatekeepers
The Best Way to Handle Objections Is to Prevent Them
Identity Beats Discipline
The Human Conversation Still Wins
I suggest you listen to the entire episode, as I was even impressed after I listened to it with how much we covered and the depth.
If you don’t, I’ve pulled out a few of the highlights for you:

AI Isn't Replacing Salespeople. It's Exposing Them.
Ray asked me what impact AI is really having on prospecting.
My answer: AI is one of the greatest tools ever created to assist salespeople.
But not to replace the actual human conversation.
The problem is that, like every other tool, some people use it as an easy button. They use it to avoid thinking, avoid preparing, avoid talking to people, and blast more spam into inboxes and voicemail boxes.
That's not selling. That's just annoying people. When it gets seen, which is not often.
The smarter salespeople are using AI to identify better prospects, gather intelligence faster, and make their messaging more relevant. So that they can have more meaningful conversations, with more of the prospects who would be more likely to be interested.
In other words, don't use the tool to avoid the work. Use the tool to do better work.
Or as I said to Ray:
Don't be a tool. Use the tool.
Personalization Without Relevance Is Just Creepy
AI can find personal data. It can find where someone went to college, what they posted three weeks ago. A picture with their mother-in-law at a holiday dinner.
But if that fact has nothing to do with the reason for your call, it is not relevance.
It's trivia. Or worse, it's creepy. Ew.
You want your personalization fo be relevant to something that is grating some friction in their world right now.
THAT is what separates sales pros from the dabblers putting in activity to hit numbers and hope they randomly find someone slightly interested.
Pattern Interrupts Should Not Be Gimmicks
I talked about the “wussification” of sales, and how cold callers apologize for calling by saying "this is a cold call," or "You can hang up if you want." They say they are being transparent and using a pattern interrupt.
They are actually easing their own insecurities about calling someone.
And the very best pattern interrupt is knowing something about the prospect that is relevant to their world right now.
That gets attention.
That causes them to think:
"This is different. This person knows something about us."
That's Smart Calling.
Your Value Proposition Isn't a Value Proposition Yet
I don't like the term "value proposition" by itself.
Because who says it's value?
You?
It's only value if the prospect determines it is.
That's why I call it a Possible Value Proposition.
You're making an educated assumption that what you do might be valuable based on what you know about them.
That keeps you from sounding like every other salesperson who shows up and declares:
"We help companies increase efficiency, reduce costs, and improve productivity."
Well, congratulations. So does every other brochure on the internet.
A Possible Value Proposition is tied to something specific, relevant, and likely important to them.
That's what creates curiosity.
The Opening Has Only Two Jobs
Most salespeople try to accomplish too much in their opening.
They try to explain.
Pitch.
Impress.
Qualify.
Get the meeting.
Prove credibility.
Overcome objections before they even exist.
No wonder prospects shut down.
The opening has only two objectives:
First, put the prospect in a positive, receptive frame of mind.
Second, move naturally into questions.
That's it.
Not to get 15 minutes on their calendar.
Not to dump your pitch.
Not to explain your entire company.
Just create enough interest and relevance that the prospect is willing to continue the conversation.
Earn the next sentence.
Stop Asking for Another Call When
You're Already On One
One of the hardest things in prospecting is getting someone on the phone.
So let me get this right.
You finally get someone on the phone.
You get them engaged.
They are talking with you.
And then your goal is to get them off the phone so you can schedule another phone call?
I know there are companies with SDR/BDR processes where the goal is to set the meeting. I understand that.
But in many cases, salespeople create unnecessary friction by forcing the process instead of following the conversation.
If the person is engaged, keep going.
Ask another question.
Learn more.
Qualify further.
If the music is still playing, stay on the dance floor.
The Salesperson's Oath: First, Create No Resistance
Doctors have the Hippocratic Oath:
First, do no harm.
Salespeople need one too. I modified that oath to The Salesperson’s Oath:
First, create no resistance.
First, create no resistance.
Before you open your mouth on a prospecting call, look at every word in your opening and ask:
"Could any reasonable prospect resist this?"
If yes, why would you say it?
You control the first 10-15 seconds. So why choose words that are likely to put the prospect into a negative frame of mind?
"Sorry to bother you."
"This is a cold call."
"Do you have a minute?"
"I know you're busy."
Those aren't harmless. They create brain-triggered resistance.
Use the first few seconds to create curiosity and relevance instead.
Assistants Are Not Gatekeepers
I hate the terms gatekeeper and screener.
Those words already frame the person as an enemy.
Assistants are not just the buyer's assistants. They can and should be your assistants too.
They can give real-time intelligence you won't find online. The very best kind.
They’ll tell you what matters, who is involved, what initiatives are happening, and whether your message is relevant. They can give you personal info about your prospect you’d never find anywhere.
And if you treat them like the intelligent humans they are, instead of these evil enemies some gurus suggest they are… barriers to be "gotten past," they can actually prep the decision maker to want to hear from you. I’ve done that most of my career.
In speaking with one assistant, I found out she was the one who referred me to her boss to speak at their National Sales Meeting because she saw me at a similar meeting at her previous meeting and crushed it. The boss was already sold by the time I finally spoke with him.
A person inside the organization is often your best source of Smart Calling Intel.
Use that opportunity wisely.
The Best Way to Handle Objections Is to Prevent Them
People love "objection rebuttals."
"Five ways to overcome price resistance."
"Seven ways to handle 'send me information.'"
"Ten magic phrases for 'we're all set.'"
Here's a better idea: Prevent the objection from coming up in the first place.
Most objections are created earlier in the conversation.
By bad openings.
Poor questions.
Premature pitching.
Talking about your product before you know what matters to them.
Not digging below the first answer.
The first question is usually just the tip of the iceberg. The good stuff comes from the follow-up.
"Why is that?"
"What caused that?"
"How is that affecting you?"
"What happens if that continues?"
Better questions don't just uncover needs. They prevent objections.
Identity Beats Discipline
Most sales training focuses on what to say and how to say it.
That's important. But it is not enough.
Because if someone does not see themselves as the type of person who makes the calls, asks the questions, follows up, handles resistance, and does the work, the tactics won't stick.
It's like buying a gym membership on January 1st and quitting by January 7th.
The person didn't become the person who works out.
They just tried to force the activity.
Same with sales.
The best salespeople don't just do prospecting.
They become prospectors.
One of the members in my coaching group went from dreading prospecting calls to saying:
"It's just something I can't not do anymore."
That's identity.
We discussed how I devoted an entire year to developing this, and salesperson-specific deep training that transforms salesperson identity, and another year testing it. It’s the Ultimate Sales Professional… check it out.
The Human Conversation Still Wins
Ray asked what has changed in sales over the years.
My answer was that about 90% of the fundamentals are still the same.
The tools changed.
The channels changed.
The technology changed.
But people are still people.
They still want things.
They still want to avoid things.
They still care most about what is relevant to them.
They still respond better to a real human conversation than a canned pitch.
That's why the fundamentals still matter. Maybe more than ever.
Because as more sellers hide behind automation, AI, scripts, and volume, the salesperson who can create a relevant, intelligent, human conversation stands out even more.
Ray asked great questions and pushed the conversation into areas I think you'll find useful.
You can listen to the full episode here:
And if you do, send me your biggest takeaway.
If any of what Ray and I talked about resonated … especially the part about the opening …I put the most important piece of this into a program called The First 20 Seconds Formula.
It's the proven four-part Smart Calling framework that tells you exactly what to say in those first seconds, in what order, and why each piece works.
Thirty-seven dollars. You can go through it in one sitting and use it on your very next call.
Get The First 20 Seconds Formula here → http://First20Seconds.com
Go make it your best week ever!



